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PARTISAN REVIEW
abso lu te fa ith in hi s importance and worked very ha rd to make
Rauschen berg a famou s pa in ter and that it was as the res ul t of our
pro lo nged effo rts tha t he got to the Bienna le, tha t he go t the pri ze.
From th e audience:
Wh a t do you do to build up your a rti sts?
Castell i:
Build them up? Well , one thing is, first, complete and to ta l
beli ef in the a rti st.
If
you don 't beli eve in him, you can ' t build him
u p. I had rea ll y a fana tical enthusiasm. You can 't imagine how
fanati cal it was. Now everything has sort o f taken its course and
man y yea rs have gone by. But how fana ti cal I was about the artists,
li ke Rauschenberg, like John s, like Li chten stein , the ea rl y times, and
therefore I felt it was a lmos t like a mi ssion to p romo t.e them . I was
very much ass isted in tha t work , especia ll y with Rauschenberg and
John s, by Alan Solomon , who did a spl endid show of Rauschenberg
first, and Johns a fterwa rd s, a t the J ew ish Museum. And tha t was an
incredibl y influenti a l event. Perhaps it was no t understood how
importan t it was a t tha t time, but certa inl y it contribu ted enor–
mo usly to Rauschenberg 's getting the prize a t the Veni ce Bienna le.
Diamonstein:
Excludin g Lichten stein , who are your favorite arti sts?
Castell i:
T here a re Johns, Rauschenberg , and p robabl y the first o nes
tha t I had who went in a certa in directi on. T hen there is Frank
Stell a. Now I have two new a rti sts tha t a re pretty abstract. T hey a re
Ell swo rth Kell y and Kenneth No land . T hen there a re Oldenburg,
Andy Warho l, and Rosenqui st. T hen come the Minimal a rti sts like
Bo b Mo rri s and Do na ld Judd. Wh a t comes next is a little obscu re.
But let's stop here and no t make a longer li st.
Diamonstein:
Roy, excludin g Leo, who is your favo rite artist?
Lichtenstein:
Duccio .
Cas telli:
An Ita li an arti st of the thirteenth century.
L ichtenstein:
Duccio di Buoninsegna o f Siena.
Diamonstein:
There has a lways been a class ica l influence on your
wo rk , an info rmed sensibility. Wha t abo ut the influence of architec–
ture?
L ichtenstein:
Just pediments and things tha t I' ve seen around New
Yo rk City. I sta rted
to
do those in black and white. We're ta lking
abo ut those long pa intings tha t have architectura l mo tifs. I took
some pho tographs o f buildings in bri ght sunlight with the shadow
coming down to show the architectura l deta il. I did those black and
white pa intings maybe fo ur o r five years befo re, and then I fo und a
way o f adding colo r and o ther texture to the work , and did my recent
work in th at area.
Diamonstein:
Is shape more impo rtant
to
you than colo r?
L ichtenstein:
Yes. I think shape is mo re impo rtant than co lo r. It's the
